Recently some sub-genres, like "Marvel Cinematic Universe" and "Superhero" were added to movies. In my opinion these are not genres, like to know how you think about it.

Agreed on the first. It's overly specific, and not at all practical in regards to this specific site, a general films website, not one centered around superhero franchises.

I don't agree with you fully on the second as a sub-genre. It's a broad enough descriptor that it seems workable. The only issue I have is that it's open to abuse/misuse, due to a lack of set naming standards.

Also, I'm enjoying the latest spam attack on the forums... Fun!

I think superhero is a sub genre. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Superhero_film

Marvel Cinematic Universe is not. I think Wikipedia is spot on. “The Marvel Cinematic Universe (MCU) is an American media franchise and shared universe that is centered on a series of superhero films.” https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marvel_Cinematic_Universe

I agree with oteis. The superhero film is certainly a sub-genre of fantasy/SF. Yet a franchise is separate again. Otherwise we could list James Bond or Star Wars, and Universal Monsters as subgenres.

On the question of Genre. Can we have Music and Music Video as genres please? Something in me hurts when I have to list concert films as documentary, then add a subgenre. And it hurts more when it comes to music video!

Can we have Music and Music Video as genres please?

Music and Performance should be a genre. Performance would cover non-music arts as well, like Ballet, theater, etc.

I agree, Music and Performance is a good one

It can be argued that Music Video is a form all of its own. As the website EK_ links to seems to suggest. It is not purely promo, not only performance, not completely pre-produced (scripted) like shorts; though frequently carrying much of each of these.

For example, there are numerous examples of visual settings of pre-existing music by short filmmakers that are not music video. See Len Lye, Oscar Fishinger etc for examples. What makes these 'settings' not 'music video' is that they are not selling a particular artist in their construction and subsequent use. That promo facility is key to music video - but it gets complicated when music acts started releasing whole albums on DVD. Still usable as promos, yet they are also unique works in themselves.

Indeed, it has been suggested there are what might be called subgenres within music video, performance being one of them, alongside narrative and concept. Andrew Goodwin argues as much in 'Dancing in the Distraction Factory', his book on music video. Certain music genres / subcultures favour certain visual styles and narrative tropes - see how performance elements might increase in rock music video as opposed to (e.g.) dance music, which can be more concept driven and/or displace the performance onto depiction of an audience dancing.

However, Music and Performance as a genre would be a start...

As far as i know these are not genres right??
• National Film Registry
• Crossdressing

I really should spend more time on the forums. :)

I'm the person/jerkface who's been adding the various sub-genre tags. I agree that none of these should be genres, but should the sub-genre tags not be wide open? Is "Franchise" the dividing line?

As for "National Film Registry", I thought, similar to say, "Neo Noir" or "Blaxploitation" or "Silent Film", there should be a user-defined link to all films in the NFR. If the user base disagrees, no offense taken, but it makes sense to me as a viewer.

TL;DR: IMHO genres should be very clearly defined, sub-genres should be infinite and broad.

The National Film Registry (NFR) is the United States National Film Preservation Board's (NFPB) selection of films deserving of preservation. (Wikipedia)

This is not a genre or sub genre. This is all about preserving American film history. If a movie is added to the NFR, it can be put in notes or/and add a link to the page on the NFR website.

As for “Crossdressing”. I think it’s arguably as a sub genre. As far as the film Some Like It Hot where it was added. The fact that man dress up as woman doesn’t make it a “Crossdressing” film. It could be applicable on other films though.

Oteis, I think we're just at different opinions on this. I can see your point about holding to a narrow definition of sub-genre. I'd argue that, since it's a searchable user-defined field, we should, at this "early" stage, be open to any addition under the sub-genre field. Why SHOULDN'T someone be able to reference any Marvel Cinematic Universe film, or films from India, via the sub-genre field?

I'll leave it to our fine mods to point what direction we should take this going forward.

Neither NFR nor crossdressing are generic. Other than switching clothes, where is the generic consistency between 'Fantastic Woman' and 'Some Like it Hot'? Or between 'Morocco' and 'Jules et Jim'?

I suggest that with both examples there is confusion between genre and general tagging, (or keywords as they are called on IMDb).

Perhaps that is what is required here, a tag field.

As nouns the difference between genre and trope is that genre is a kind; a stylistic category or sort, especially of literature or other artworks while trope is (literature) something recurring across a genre or type of literature, such as the ‘mad scientist’ of horror movies or ‘once upon a time’ as an introduction to fairy tales similar to archetype and but not necessarily pejorative.

Why SHOULDN'T someone be able to reference any Marvel Cinematic Universe film, or films from India, via the sub-genre field?

Because those are not sub-genres. The MCU is a franchise. Country of origin is a location.

Now that genre's are mandatory - I'm still at a loss as to where to put music video. I don't think Musical is quite the same thing.

@sixandnine: I feel your pain. I don't think Musical is a perfect fit, although I've been offsetting it by adding a narrative genre (Drama, Avant-Garde, Experimental, etc.) and the "Music Video"/"Short Film" tags in sub-genre.

"Musical" is a feature-length film with musical numbers. "Music" is what I use as a sub-genre for music videos, because MV's are ultimately about the music more than anything else. Visuals are just a vehicle for the music itself. Visuals are incidental in the context of music videos.

Anyway, the site is still more or less in its infancy, though. "Music" or "Music Video" seem like the most ideal choices to me. Users will ultimately decide which term becomes the established rule here, I believe.

Things like films in the National Film Registry are more closely related to "Series" than "Genre" at any rate, and even that isn't an ideal category for it. I would be perfectly fine with having yet another field for "archived" or "preserved" films: "Archived By/Under: Cultural Institution XYZ"

TBH, the more I think about it, the more I think maybe MV's need a unique film "form", because, as I stated, they are only incidentally "films", and MV's are really something unto themselves in that respect. It would be fine with me to make "Music Video" its own special sub-set of the "Film" concept. Would be A-OK with me if we did this for TV series, too. They'd all just be subsets of the same abstract concept that is "Film", still serving the same purpose/having the same layout as film pages.

If Star Wars series is a sub-genre, so Astrid Lindgren film must be able to be a sub-genre
https://www.filmo.gs/browse/film?sub-genre=Star%20Wars%20Series
https://www.filmo.gs/film/167638-har-kommer-pippi-langstrump/history

If Star Wars series is a sub-genre, so Astrid Lindgren film must be able to be a sub-genre

Star Wars is not A sub-genre, but a franchise. Star Wars should be removed from sub-genre, just like Marvel Cinematic Universe.

Astrid Lindgren film must be able to be a sub-genre

Should Stephen King have its own sub-genre... or John Grisham??? I think not!

"SHOUTING" SHOULD BE A SUB-GENRE!!!

https://www.loc.gov/rr/mopic/miggen.html EK_ 2 months ago

This list of genres seems very useful. Can I use it when I continue to work here at Filmogs?

For what it's worth, I grant you permission Botros!

"SHOUTING" SHOULD BE A SUB-GENRE!!!

If we talk to each other without shouting, I think our work will be better.

Should Stephen King have its own sub-genre... or John Grisham??? I think not!

It is of course not necessary to create new links to different authors, I understand that now, they are already under the heading of credit. If, on the other hand, a movie is part of a series, and the individual films have different authors and directors, it may be difficult to see the connection. Is the only way now to show the connection, that I leave an information in the comment field?

it may be difficult to see the connection. Is the only way now to show the connection, that I leave an information in the comment field?

Don’t get me wrong I meant no harm with correcting the sub-genre on Lindgren. Leaving that info in the notes field won’t create a visible connection. However you can always search for Astrid Lindgren and see her work under her profile.
Maybe a “tag field” could be a solution for all this. So people can search for Marvel, DC, Stephen King, Astrid Lindgren, Star Wars, etc. just a suggestion...

In spite of being part of the problem earlier, I've come around on oteis and EK_'s way of thinking on this matter. Sub-genre SHOULD remain somewhat restrictive, IMHO. Let's leave it to actual sub-genres like "Space Opera", "Blaxploitation", "Softcore", "Romatic Comedy", etc.

I'll second the request for a tag field. Hell, I'll even go through and correct a bunch myself. I like being able to search by "Star Wars" or "MCU", but sub-genre no longer feels like the right place to do it.

What about this? - fictional characters
https://www.filmo.gs/credit/31395-james-bond

What about this? - fictional characters

Very questionable if you ask me. James Bond was added as a series. If you ask me this is incorrect. Again like Star Wars, Marvel Cinematic Universe this is a franchise.

Why would a fictional character get a CREDIT page? Completely incorrect.

No, fictional characters should not have a credit page. Otherwise we should have to create a lote of fictional pages like Bambi, Ant-man, Iron Man, Forrest Gump etc.

do we really need a sub genre for every plot?? this subgenre was created recently... "MAD SCIENTIST"

https://www.filmo.gs/browse/film?sub-genre=Mad%20Scientist

here's another one: LITERARY ADAPTATION. It could be used for over half of the database...
https://www.filmo.gs/browse/film?sub-genre=Literary%20Adaptation

Users are just making things up.

https://www.loc.gov/rr/mopic/miggen.html

Login or Register to post a reply to this topic.